I think this might be the first bit of Old Republic news that’s actually put me in a bad mood, but here goes: apparently the final two TOR classes have been leaked, and yup, they’re both Force-using Jedi/Sith-heads. AKA, Jedi Counsular and the Sith Inquisitor.
Now, it’s not official-official, but when you see pages like this, it’s more than halfway there. I’ve heard several commentators in the past talk about how they were absolutely, positively sure the final two classes would be Force-users, and I’d keep biting my tongue from going on verbal rampages about how stupid that would be. That you’d create a Star Wars MMO where fully half of the 8 classes were more or less the same class, just with slightly different magic and various types of laser-swords.
I can see it now — on the field of battle, a meager band of Troopers, Bounty Hunters, Smugglers and Agents huddle in a defensive circle as they face the onslaught of a bajillion (jumping) Jedi. It’s like BioWare went all meta on us, and while there are two official main factions, there’s also the have and have-not factions of Force users and non-Force users.
I guess I’m also disappointed that this is the extent of their creativity in terms of classes. Eight classes seemed to be very limited in number, so I hoped for the maximum amount of variety and uniqueness with what they did have. We’ll wait to hear more details, but honestly — how different can a Jedi Knight and a Jedi Counsular really be?
P.S. – I apologize if I’m coming across as crabby today (you know, more than usual). Very, very little sleep this weekend makes Syp a grunty blogger.
Dude, I lost some pop through my nose with that picture. Thanks for making people look at me funny (funnier) in the office.
As for the fiddy percent force-users thing…..I just hope they can pull it off.
“how different can a Jedi Knight and a Jedi Counsular really be?”
Maybe the equivilents of a Paladin and a Priest?
It’d be interesting if it turned out these were the healing classes.
Woot, can’t wait to Force bunny hop around Syp!
That’s an interesting thought Winged. Does that mean Knight/Warrior are the tanks than? So basically support roles are force users and dps is non-force?
And all that infectious hype comes crashing down.
I’d bet the farm that these are healing classes. It looks clear enough to me that the Knight and Warrior are tank types, Consular and Inquisitor are healer types, and the rest are damage/utility. Its an MMO at the end of the day, so I don’t see how you can do a game without the trinity. Then again, I don’t have my armchair game designer cap on right now so perhaps I haven’t solved all the big problems yet
“That you’d create a Star Wars MMO where fully half of the 8 classes were more or less the same class, just with slightly different magic and various types of laser-swords.”
I don’t see any reason to believe this is so. In fact, bioware probably did this to avoid the situation in which half the players are the same class. For many, sith/jedi is where it’s at, and they’re going to roll one no matter what, so this means that they’re spread over two classes instead of one. I seriously doubt Bioware is stupid enough to make them too similar.
While no doubt some people who were going to role a non-force user are now going inquisitor/consular, I’m sure it’ll be more people who otherwise were going knight/warrior. Which in turn, will bring down the force using classes individual populations closer to the others. The best way to guarantee brutal imbalance would have been to only put one force-user on each side.
I’m unsurprised, since TOR as far as I can tell is Star Wars shoehorned into EQ/WoW/Diku.
Casting classes = popular.
I would be willing to bet they would include some form of CC and have lesser combat prowess of the other saber wielders.
I will probably go away from playing a Jedi since there will be so many of those running around the need for the other classes will be greater. Besides, I always wanted to be an Imperial lackey
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From a Star Wars wiki…
“A Jedi Consular (also called a Jedi seer) was, like all Jedi, skilled in battle, but rarely entered combat, preferring to study the mysteries of the Force. Consulars were the primary scholars and diplomats and seers of the Order, often becoming instructors.
What the Jedi Guardian preferred to achieve by combat, the Jedi Consular achieved by words or the Force. Traditionally, they wielded a green lightsaber, but, like all Jedi, they were free to choose their own color for the blade.
When they attained the rank of Jedi Master, consulars became known as Sage Masters.
Two Sage Masters joined with two Warrior Masters to build the initial Jedi Temple on Coruscant.”
Sounds like Winged might be quite right.
Since Star Wars is really just a fantasy story with space opera trappings, I imagine the new force users will map to the hybrid classes in other MMOs. Maybe they won’t even get light sabers.
It does kind of cheapen the whole uniqueness of being a Jedi/Sith if most of the people you encounter are part of those secretive, cloistered orders.
Like, if half the people you met in real life were Catholic nuns and monks.
Wait, I’m confused. Bioware told Germany?
I can understand your frustration, Syp, and I guess I’m a little disappointed myself. But from those screenshots and my rudimentary knowledge of German, I think the Sith Inquisitor actually looks really cool.
Also, I think that after the first few months we will see the ranks of the non-force-users grow. If the various classes are well-balanced, people will ultimately choose their main based on gameplay factors as well as lore. And if I’m wrong? At least Bioware balanced the factions by giving them both a class that nobody will want to play
I’m guessing these new classes have Yoda and Emperor Palpatine as their character archetypes. The Knight/Warrior will be melee oriented and the Consular/Inquisitor will be holier-than-thou casters.
ICH HABE DIE MACHT!
(continued) they could make things hard for force users, similar to things EQ did for monks. For instance, jedi/siths can’t carry loot. Only food, clothing, their lightsaber and robes, money and other basic supplies. No bank, no inventory. Neither Jedi nor Sith care much for worldly goods. The Force provides.
I’ll point to the KOTOR games as examples of many variations on the same basic Jedi package — somewhat different flavors, but in the end, a Jedi Sentinel and a Jedi Counsular weren’t different enough to be considered separate classes, just specialties.
But yeah, we do need more info before an informed decision — this is just my gut reaction.
No surprises and I figured they would have more than one Jedi/Sith class on each side. Peeps love their Jedi and Bioware seem intent to making up for the fact that SWG didn’t have Jedi when it came out.
yeah, I’ve seen this a couple of places and I share the disappointment – I was really hoping the jedi/sith would be generic enough that you could spec them as a counsular type if you wanted to. Something like the Dragon Age skill tree in that you can’t possible level everything up but can get a single tree maxed quite easily or get a mixture of the 3 or 4 trees.
Sadly it appears that any of the other cool sounding non-force users (droid engineerer, politician, etc.) will have to wait for the 1st xpack.
After reading this post I went and read some Jedi stuff on Wookipedia. I have to say I am utterly disappointed at how they have written the Jedi in the Old Republic days. Seems like they have forgotten the basic ideals Jedi were based on.
“A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge. Never for attack.” Totally forgotten and ignored.
Kind of like how the movie Twilight ignored basic Vampire lore. Shiny in the sunlight rather than dead.
It’s Star Wars dude. You’re lucky there are 8 classes, since there are only 3 basic classes; Han Solo, Boba Fett, and Luke Skywalker. Variants on those three types are about all you’re going to get.
well, warrior is armor tank, knight is ability tank, 4 classes are utility DPS and 2 healers.
what i really think is – we still dont have a real answer are classes only faction based. i mean bioware told us you can be sith but good and jedi but rather not good.
so what if we are not having 4 classes for each side but 8 classes total?
Most MMOs that rely on the tank/healer/dps trinity seem to have a shortage of tanks and/or healers.
If you make the Jedi classes the tanks and healers I doubt you’d see that shortage in SW:TOR. It would be an interesting way to make sure there are enough people playing tanks/healers.
And if the non-Jedi classes are the true dps that’s a great way to get people to play those classes as well. If someone wants to be the king of dps they’d be forced into using a non-Force using class.
If they try to pigeon hole Jedi and wielders of the Force as Healers you’ll just end up with the equivalent of Shadow Priests and Cat Druids.
“You want me to heal? Dude, I don’t do that *$&%! I’m a *#$&%ing Jedi, man!”
That would actually be an excellent, but not very popular way around having every man & their dog roll a Jedi if they were designed primarily as Healers, with limited DPS capabilities such that it would be impractical for a Raid to take a DPS Jedi over pretty much any other class.
If I remember right, you left out part of the quote: “A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge AND DEFENSE, never attack.”
Given that America has gone through a bit of debate lately over what exactly constitutes “defense” I fully expect the Jedi could have as well. You’re also looking at thousands of years between the two settings – claiming philosophy from the core movies as inviolable for a setting that is essentially prehistoric seems like a bit of overkill.
As for the new classes… People who were going to play Jedi will play Jedi. I actually think this is a very good move, because it will create a bit of variety in ability among the throngs. From a theme perspective Jedi will still be overwhelming numbers-wise, but from a gameplay perspective this will lead to greater diversity of ability and style. That seems like a win to me.
So if the last pair of classes weren’t going to be Jedi/Sith variants, what would you suggest they be, Syp?
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If people don’t like playing healers and tanks, they won’t play them in the end. The might roll them at the start, but they will not play them in the end game just cause their magic form is the force instead of mana, rage, or what have you.